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#1 fullsizeblazin

 
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Posted 03 February 2018 - 12:11 AM

This must be a record you guys. A family member has a 2011 E350 work van, and the transmission grenaded at 50,000 miles. Vehicle has been lightly driven and the fluid still looked brand new. This must be high mileage for a Ford transmission.

Oh, and Ford knows all about this problem.

http://www.revbase.c...adPdf?id=182374

6 months past this supposed extended warranty and what does Ford say? # Sand.

Unbelievable. This is why I would never own a Ford. Clockwork lemons as Salty used to call them.

#2 Karrpilot

 
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Posted 03 February 2018 - 08:33 AM

I took my step mother's sister's Mustang in to get looked at, complete with a printed out TSB in my hand, to the local Ford dealership that we have our fleet vehicles repaired when they are still under warranty. The ass clown said that since the warranty had expired 6 months prior to me showing up, they would not warranty it. He also said that they could do 1/2 of the TSB, see if that fixed it, before doing the rest of the TSB. All on our dime.

 

I said to the fool, WHERE in this TSB does it say to do that? It says to do EVERYTHING! I also asked about Ford's AWA plan. The After Warranty Adjustment program. Where the repair is reviewed, and the costs are split up between the dealership, Ford corporate, and the vehicle owner. He said that even though the vehicle was still in warranty by mileage, it was out of warranty by time. Basically, he told me to go away.

 

So I got our fleet service representative involved. She told me the very same things. No such assistance. Then I told her about when my Pontiac rear main seal sprung a leak. I was out of warranty by time as well, but still in warranty by mileage. GM covered my repair for 60%, and I had to pony up the remaining 40%. And you are telling me Ford can not offer a similar customer satisfaction program? Screw Ford.

 

So I looked up the Ford TSB part numbers, ordered them all from Rock Auto, (I wasn't going back to the dealer anytime soon), and started to work on her car in my driveway. The TSB parts didn't fix the issue, but through an elimination process, starting out with knocking out a known product problem, I traced down and found what was the underlying issue, I fixed it.

 

My advise to everyone is to stay out and away from FMC. When that warranty expires, so does your relationship..........


No longer working at dealerships. Government employee. Now i get paid to fix Fords.
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#3 Mike N

 
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Posted 03 February 2018 - 07:36 PM

Clockwork lemons

 

Great name for a band.....


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1981 Camaro. 10.30's@130 mph.


#4 Ron W.

 
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Posted 03 February 2018 - 11:27 PM

Might be I've just been lucky but..... My 97 F150 4x4 5.4L E4OD Trans. at 235k miles has required nothing more than wear items. Tires, brakes, suspension components, hub and bearing, battery, belt, alternator, plugs, 3 cops,  filters, fluids etc. Still has original water pump, upper and lower radiator hoses and starter. Never even had to change a valve cover gasket.

 

My 06 Mustang GT at 94k miles the same, just wear items.

 

Now excuse me while I go knock on wood.


If you can do no good at least do no harm

Working in automotive since 1973, Ford from June of 1992 to October 2006
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#5 Karrpilot

 
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Posted 06 February 2018 - 09:41 PM

Longevity of certain items is one thing. A known product problem, and weaseling out from doing anything about said problem, is quite another. From what I have been experiencing with our fleet vehicles, I am not so sure which product maker is worse. Ford or Chrysler. When it comes down to standing behind their vehicles. Both try to play dumb and or deny us service. GM is far the better.

 

Since we don't have or use foreign makes, I can not give out any opinion regarding service after the sale, especially when the warranty expires. But if the general public out there are treated like we are at any Ford or Chrysler store, they wouldn't dare go back. Certainly not for any customer paid repairs.

 

I have had mechanics go to lunch without saying a word, I have been told I showed up too late in the day for a recall, etc. Since when is 1:00 too late in the day to get a recall done? When the book time says the repair should only take 1/2 hour? Guess which names were over the dealerships doors? Hint: They were not GM stores............


No longer working at dealerships. Government employee. Now i get paid to fix Fords.
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#6 fullsizeblazin

 
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Posted 06 February 2018 - 11:58 PM

KP, thats why the F-150 is the best selling truck. If they didnt weasel their way out of their known problems, they couldnt get the dumbass to buy another...

Most of the oldest fleets Ive seen in municipalities, lawn care businesses, snow plows etc have 70s - 90s GM trucks. Theres a reason. Simple design, reliability, and parts availability. Once a Ford or Chrysler reaches 5 years old, parts are obsolete. I imagine this will eventually be the industry standard for all, but its more common in the other two.

Sounds like Ron is a good owner and his Fords have lasted, but even good owners cant make a manufacturer defect like an incorrect thrust bearing on a planetary gear set not happen.. I will say Fords may good looking cars and trucks, just dont like always dealing with their problems.

#7 Karrpilot

 
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Posted 07 February 2018 - 05:54 PM

Ford was obsoleting their parts years before I left. On some of their vehicles that were still covered under the new vehicle warranty! I heard a rumor that Ford was getting out of the parts stocking end of it, and were thrusting that little issue / problem onto their vendors and suppliers. Well, we all know how that worked out. Ford acting and dictating their business like Wall Mart does, and pretty soon, fewer and fewer people want to do business with them. Firestone being the biggest name.........

 

I also heard that by doing this and getting out of part stocking and warehousing, this let Ford sell off unused real estate, and not have to heat and cool said buildings. Probably the automotive meltdown had something to do with this, and made the decision easier for Ford. As well as avoid the government bailouts that GM and Chrysler had to endure.

 

My first car was a 1967 Chevelle. On a icy driveway, I got in and slipped. While doing so, my knee sheared off my turn signal lever. This was around 1979-1980. I went to my local Chevrolet dealer, and they had one in stock. Just you try and get a part now from a Ford dealership for a vehicle 12-13 years old like I did. Let me know how that works out for you.........


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#8 ok44

 
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Posted 11 February 2018 - 03:16 PM

I can't complain about my Ford transmissions. My current Lincoln with an untouched 4R70W still shifts like new at almost 300k miles.

 

The prior LIncoln with the same trans was still as new at 250k miles until a moron in a Dodge chose to run a red light.

 

My daughter's '05 Mustang at 220k miles has needed nothing.

 

Another Ford of mine with an AOD has 200k miles with zero transmission problems.

 

An '87 Sable I had dropped a transmission at 130k miles but the car was purchased used with 90k miles on it and I have no idea how it was maintained before I bought it.

I installed a boneyard 40k miles transmission in it and put another 300k miles on the car so a 340k miles FWD that was still shifting fine at 340.

 

Then again, I do a fluid and filter change every 30k miles no matter what. Maybe that's the difference. 

 

They all use planned obsolescence. Back in the late 80s I heard a bunch of hammering in the parts dept of the Subaru/VW/Fiat dealership where I worked. I discovered the factory parts rep on his hands and knees using a 3 pound ball peen to smash brand new factory parts. From wheel brake cylinders to windshields, to alternators; they were all taking a beating.

 

I started cursing the guy because we used those parts day in and day out so he was just making our job exponentially harder. According to him, it was part of Subaru's Buy Back Program to "clean the clutter off the dealer shelves" because Subaru was "going to start major redesign changes every 6 to 7 years and those parts needed to go". Some of those parts fit 3 and 4 year old cars.....

So after taking a whaling with the hammer the parts were loaded up and hauled to the dumpster.

 

Shows how stupid the dealers were. They were being offered cost LESS 10% to get them off the shelves. Immediate cash flow even if it was a losing proposition. A few dealers did not go along with this BS.



#9 Mike N

 
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Posted 13 February 2018 - 07:18 PM

Subaru/VW/Fiat dealership

 

Could it possibly get any worse than that?


Horsepower sells cars, Torque wins races.
1981 Camaro. 10.30's@130 mph.


#10 von schlieffen

 
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Posted 13 February 2018 - 07:47 PM

At Toyota it's quite the opposite with after warranty support. Instead of telling the customer to go pound sand with his 150k ill-maintained vehicle, Toyota will pay for most things if you complain loudly enough. And the tech gets to fix said shitboxes, for warranty time, of course. Currently if you have a 2007 or newer Camry, Scion TC, Corolla, RAV4, or Prius, with a 4-cylinder engine and it consumes more than 1 quart of oil per 1200 miles, we will overhaul the engine for free, regardless of maintenance, mileage, or condition. No oil change receipts needed, and the car doesn't have to be in running condition. Drove it till it ran dry and seized the crankshaft? No problem, we will fix it for free. Camshaft snapped, same. Toyota will pay for any internal engine parts up to and including a block, crank, and cylinder head. Additionally, we were told the following from our factory rep: If a car has another external problem, like a leaky water pump, bad belt tensioner, cracked manifold, etc.--anything that gets pulled out along with the engine-- to attempt to sell the additional repair to the customer. Here's the kicker though: If they decline, just put it on anyway, and Toyota will cover it. Only, no additional labor allowance.

 

For all of this, we get paid between 14 and 16 hours. The job is, at minimum, a re-ring with new pistons and usually new rod bearings, to at the worst case, a block, crankshaft, and head (cylinder heads come bare, of course, and require you to play the valve adjuster shim matching game to make them work). Often, these cars are nearly undriveable, clearly not maintained, and have 150k or more on them- but if the customer makes the claim they are burning oil, we fix them. If the car is in running condition we are supposed to perform a consumption test (according to the service manager they all fail) but if the engine is seized, knocking, or otherwise kaput, it simply gets the repair.

 

The moral of the story is, if you're a dealer tech, be careful what you wish for. After-warranty support is a slippery slope, and you may find yourself on the wrong end of it. 50k miles, sure, some help would be perfectly reasonable. 150k on a rolling junk pile is out of control.



#11 ok44

 
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Posted 14 February 2018 - 11:12 AM

I'd be in heaven over 14-16 hours on a warranty engine fix. Subaru pays 10. Maybe. Almost everything in the warranty manual is .2.

Halfshaft replacement? .2

A/C system seal? .2

Electrical system diagnosis? .2-.5. Maybe...

 

Funny story about the dealer I mentioned taking on Fiats back in the 80s. They had a shop meeting to announce we were now going to be a FIat dealer. There was a collective groan from all of us.

The dealer said we had bad attitudes and that Fiat would be a wonderful addition and a money maker. One mechanic piped up "You do know that Fiat dealers go broke don't you"?.

 

This was in the late fall of 1984. So several weeks later 2 transports pulled in with loads of "New" Fiats.  Management was tickled to death......until later that day while processing the paper. That's when they discovered the cars were BRAND NEW all right; brand new 1983 models as the 1985 models of every other make was hitting the lots.

Two model years old already.......



#12 von schlieffen

 
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Posted 14 February 2018 - 08:06 PM

Toyota's warranty times for the various engine rebuilds are never generous, just barebones, but often doable. The aforementioned engine job can be done in two days if everything goes perfectly, all parts are in stock, and if you seiously half-ass cleaning up all the mating surfaces before applying sealer. Those japanese use RTV for everything, and to properly clean and degrease everything is easily 3 hours. There is of course no time for that, so you just sort of scrape it with a razor blade and squirt some new goop on top. Sometimes they come back leaking but often they never come back. Most of the cars are from the ghetto anyway and probably get parked in a different spot on the street each day so you never see the puddle.

 

Warranty times for other things are all over the map- something like machining rotors for a pedal pulsation pays 2.2 usually, which is great. Water pump on a V6 that requires partial engine removal is 1.9 hr-- pretty terrible. And no warranty diag time for anything, ever. Which of course means no attempt is made at diagnosing anything under warranty, ever.

 

One thing I am thankful for, however: No transmission repairs. Anything beyond replacing a torque converter, shift solenoid, or complete valve body, calls for a replacement unit. Sure, you get to put it in for 7.5 hours, but then you're done and you can move on. No dead cars sitting on the lift waiting for a weird little seal or washer. Even the transmissions themselves aren't too bad, and all the failures seem to occur either when the car is new or after 150k, and even then it's mostly on minivans and rental cars.




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